[Massplanners] [EXTERNAL] Re: [EXTERNAL]Re: [EXTERNAL]Re: ADU Units

[daniel.j.fortier at gmail.com]

Harry,

 

I know you asked this question of a different Daniel on the listserve, but, I felt compelled to respond.

 

I think way too much time is being focused on a probability that is extremely remote. Condominium Associations generally control anything outside the walls of the existing structures. Even to the point of some association fees cover replacing roofing shingles and decks. In that scenario, you may have an exclusive use area, but are limited as to what you can place in that exclusive use area by the Association.

 

So, the first hurdle, likely to not be overcome, is that the condo association will not allow a 900 sf structure in anyone’s exclusive use areas – note I have seen many that do not allow swing sets or sheds.

 

Second hurdle is that most condominium associations have limits on rentals. So that will probably further lead to a rejection of an ADU by the association.

 

As the ADU would mean that there are additional users of association common areas and services, the Condo documents will all need to be redrafted to reassign common costs.

 

As the state expects there to be 8,000 to 10,000 ADU’s constructed statewide over the next five years, or 1,600 – 2,000 per year, spread across all 351 cities and towns, so maybe 5 to 6 ADU’s per community per year, if they are spread evenly, communities should stop thinking up crazy roadblocks to meeting one small part of the housing puzzle. This is not just a response to your issue, but to the other remote concepts raised. Do we really need to discuss the idea of an ADU being built in the parking lot of a multi-family building? Is there any real probability that a three bedroom condominium unit might be split into two-units with one considered an ADU?  If such a scenario were to arise in the next five years, it will probably only affect one of the 10,000 units. 

 

Rather, we need to focus on how to actually get some of these units built. Megan’s comments on Saturday provides some good ideas for getting these SHI eligible.

 

Daniel Fortier, AICP

Retired Planner

 

 

 

 

From: MassPlanners <massplanners-bounces at masscptc.org> On Behalf Of Harry LaCortiglia via MassPlanners
Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2025 5:36 AM
To: Daniel N. Aguiar <daguiar at fallriverma.gov>; Ryan, Christopher <cryan at belmont-ma.gov>
Cc: 'Mass Planners' <massplanners at masscptc.org>
Subject: Re: [Massplanners] [EXTERNAL] Re: [EXTERNAL]Re: [EXTERNAL]Re: ADU Units

 

Hi Daniel,

So in this scenario, if I apply to add an ADU to my condo unit, and build it 100 % in my exclusive use area, the Building Inspector would have to deny the by-right permit? 

Or grant it, but with conditions? (Requiring the governing documents be modified, and that individual owners and lenders sign off)

Interesting subject for a ZBA or a judge...

Happy shoveling!

H. LaCortiglia
Georgetown P.B. 

 

,

On 2/14/2025 8:38 AM, Daniel N. Aguiar wrote:

With regards to the condominium question I offer the following.

 

The association would need to be the applicant as owners of units only have ownership of their own unit and any exclusive use area delineated in the Condominium Documents, Master Deed and Plan.

The creation of the Adu would also require that all governing documents be modified and would likely require releases from every individual owner and subsequent lenders.

 

Daniel Aguiar

Director of Engineering & Planning

City Engineer

City of Fall River

One Government Center

Fall River, MA 02722

Telephone: 508-324-2512

Email: daguiar at fallriverma. <mailto:daguiar at fallriverma.org> gov

 

From: MassPlanners  <mailto:massplanners-bounces at masscptc.org> <massplanners-bounces at masscptc.org> On Behalf Of Ryan, Christopher via MassPlanners
Sent: Friday, February 14, 2025 8:30 AM
To: Harry LaCortiglia  <mailto:hlacortiglia at comcast.net> <hlacortiglia at comcast.net>
Cc: 'Mass Planners'  <mailto:massplanners at masscptc.org> <massplanners at masscptc.org>
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [Massplanners] [EXTERNAL]Re: [EXTERNAL]Re: ADU Units

 

CAUTION: This email originated from a sender outside of the City of Fall River mail system. Do not click on links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is safe. If you are unsure of the validity of the email, please contact IT. 

 

Great points and I am sure these situations may arise. I was also floored by the fact that these units count in an overall local housing inventory. That’s sure to create a firestorm in any community short of 10% but actively sweating it out to faithfully add affordable units.

 

Have a good weekend!

 

Chris R.

 

From: Harry LaCortiglia <hlacortiglia at comcast.net <mailto:hlacortiglia at comcast.net> > 
Sent: Friday, February 14, 2025 7:18 AM
To: Ryan, Christopher <cryan at belmont-ma.gov <mailto:cryan at belmont-ma.gov> >
Cc: 'Mass Planners' <massplanners at masscptc.org <mailto:massplanners at masscptc.org> >
Subject: [EXTERNAL]Re: [EXTERNAL]Re: [Massplanners] ADU Units

 

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Hi Ryan,

I hope the discussion can continue. 

For instance... Which one of those 20 condos on that hypothetical single lot gets the ADU? The first one to apply? 

Where on the lot it would be placed, if it were to be a detached unit, could make for some lively condo board meetings. (and litigation...)

Could a building permit be issued without the express written "permission" of the Association?  

So many questions...

Happy Valentines Friday!

H. LaCortiglia
Georgetown

 

On 2/13/2025 8:40 AM, Ryan, Christopher wrote:

Hi Harry

 

Great last question. Our Counsel opined that only one Protected Use ADU per legal lot can be established, so if the condo was on one lot and had 20 units, only one ADU would be permitted. Of course, the Condo R&Rs would need some level of specificity (likely lacking now) that would facilitate how that could be done. They also deemed the “primary dwelling” to be the largest of the buildings on the lot. I am not sure of that rationale, but hopefully we keep this analysis and discussion going.

 

Best,

 

Chris R.

Town of Belmont

 

From: MassPlanners  <mailto:massplanners-bounces at masscptc.org> <massplanners-bounces at masscptc.org> On Behalf ,

Of Harry LaCortiglia via MassPlanners
Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2025 8:24 AM
To: massplanners at masscptc.org <mailto:massplanners at masscptc.org> 
Subject: [EXTERNAL]Re: [Massplanners] ADU Units

 

CAUTION: This email originated from outside of the organization. Do not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is safe.

 

Is it Friday already?

There is a mention in the final regs (CMR 71.03 (2) (d)) under Prohibited Regulations, that Protected Use ADU's can't count in density calculations.

(d) Unit Caps & Density. Any limit, quota or other restriction on the number of Protected
Use ADUs that may be permitted, constructed, or leased within a Municipality or Zoning
District. Protected Use ADUs shall not be counted in any density calculations.

So, do ADU's only count when one is not using the number for a density calculation? ("Density Calculations" is not defined in 71.02...)

Perhaps EOHLC will someday clarify... I'm still wondering if every condo in a multi condo development can have their very own ADU.

H. LaCortiglia
Georgetown P.B.

 

 

On 2/12/2025 3:30 PM, Richard McCarthy via MassPlanners wrote:



Good afternoon, 

 

I believe an ADU will count towards our total dwelling unit count. Is that correct?

 

Thanks. 

 

Richard J. McCarthy, Jr.

Town Planner

1 Liberty Lane

Norfolk, MA 02056

508-440-2807

Office Hours- Monday through Thursday 9am to 6pm

Closed Fridays

 

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